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Serushi

Longer buff durations.

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In my opinion, all of the buff times on characters are too short.  If you have a buff based character, such as magic or charm, the current buff times can present a great annoyance — thus, I propose a change to buff durations.

I would personally love to see them unlimited (map changing aside), but I feel a duration of 30+ minutes for each buff would be pretty good and fair.

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30 minutes seems like its TOO long BUT who knows :D 

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3 hours ago, Nessie said:

30 minutes seems like its TOO long BUT who knows :D 

True, it may be a little bit silly for some people.  I think I'm just lazy and I hate how limited the skill slots are, since I have a weird setup.  :sweat:

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It's not a bad suggestion, I just think it's not necessary nor will improve anything. The duration of all buffs are fair enough in my opinion.

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2 hours ago, Sky said:

It's not a bad suggestion, I just think it's not necessary nor will improve anything. The duration of all buffs are fair enough in my opinion.

Good point, but how do you feel about buffs like Mana Reflector and Sumo Suit?  I feel those could do with an increase to buff times, at least — anything below 180 seconds is a too low IMO.

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It's kinda true though, most buffs in the Magic skill tree are a bit too short and I even end up re-casting them a long while after they had already worn off

I would suggest increasing their durations but any increase would have to be at least in a 100% increment to be noticeable and worthwhile but it could be argued that it breaks the original flow of the game and makes it easier. After all those spells do cost MP and take time to cast them so by making that problem smaller then you could argue that it's tantamount with softening the game. Trickster is not a hard game by any means, at least not if you know what you are doing and even then only at later events, but it would be best to consider what others might think.

If it was up to me then I would suggest making an open poll to see if a majority agrees on this, I say majority because a 51/49 result is a cheap democracy.

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Let's wait for other people's opinion about this. ~ We'll keep the thread open.

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20 minutes ago, Sky said:

Let's wait for other people's opinion about this. ~ We'll keep the thread open.

I was thinking about opening a new thread giving my own take on the longer buff duration suggestion but I guess that would just be cluttering the forums.

I'll build a pros and cons post and make sure to cover most aspects if this is to be considered, let alone implemented.

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38 minutes ago, ArkStrike said:

I was thinking about opening a new thread giving my own take on the longer buff duration suggestion but I guess that would just be cluttering the forums.

I'll build a pros and cons post and make sure to cover most aspects if this is to be considered, let alone implemented.

You can, then I'll merge this thread with it. 

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Let's take into consideration a simple skill that Sheep or Dragon need almost as much as they need to breathe, Mist of Mana.

These are its stats once its mastered and it will only be considered from this point since that's the end goal of any Magic build.

Level

Master

MP Cost

380

Cooldown Duration

10 seconds

MA Up

45%

Skill Duration

180 seconds

We are presented with a skill that is almost mandatory for a Magic build that is avalaible early, takes about 1 second to cast, costs 380MP to cast, its cooldown is a fraction of its duration, increases your MA by a whooping 45% but only lasts for what it takes me to eat a big slice of pizza (drink included).

Now, there are some ways to buff its duration. Some are acceptable in the realm of not fixing what isn't broken while others need some fine tuning and may or may not be possible by the devs (curse you Ntreev and your weird hard-coding stuff).

To me there are 3 options to buffing its duration:

  • The Safe Option

Increase the skill duration of Mist of Mana from 180 seconds to 300 seconds.

Increase the MP Cost of Mist of Mana from 380 to 500.

The good: Its a small increase from 3 minutes to 5 minutes that just makes it last about 66% longer. Fair increase of MP Cost.

The bad: Nothing that I can think of, the added MP cost which is around a 30% increase is barely noticeable and serves to counter-weight it.

Notes: I think we should go for this one if it were actually possible to modify skills which I don't know if it is but I'm assuming it is.

 

  • The Euphoria Option

Increase the skill duration of Mist of Mana from 180 seconds to 1800 seconds.

The good: It increases the vanilla duration from 3 minutes to 30 minutes which is 10x times longer. Meaning the skill is barely ever casted when hunting, questing or in dungeons.

The bad: The same increment can't be made to its MP Cost due to it being more MP that Magic users have initially, doubling it is a weak counter-weight and tripling it makes it a very expensive early spell.

Notes: Not recommended but if people think this is the way to go then my hands are tied.

 

  • The Carefree Option

Increase the skill duration of Mist of Mana from 180 seconds to 600 seconds.

Increase the MP Cost of Mist of Mana from 380 to 760.

The good: A sharp increase in both duration and MP cost, not exactly fair but not breaking it either.

The bad: Would become one of the most expensive skills in the Shaman and Magician skill tree, second only to Gravity Crush.

Notes: This duration is more comparable to what I see in a lot of MMORPG's lately. Casting the same skill every 3 minutes is a chore.

 

These options are only to reflect what could be done to improve the duration of the buffs since it is kind of tedious to cast necessary skills every short while. I've only ever been a Dragon and I never really got to the 2nd Job of the Buffalo or Fox and I really can't remember much of their skill trees BUT this should be valid for almost all buff skills. We are not touching the formulas, unless otherwise necessary (and it shouldn't be).

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These are good options. Let's wait for their response.

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I don't use any buffs when i'm playing, i can survive and OHKO monsters without it, is just a waste of time to cast buffs. 
Higher duration is not necessary for boss hunting, you kill it in 1- 60 sec depending on your class, so you don't need to recast buffs.
I don't understand why some players (even high level players with hax gears) activate all buffs in places that they don't need it.

It may help in Harkon Protector. 
It may help low level players. 
However, i agree with Sky, i don't think that will improve anything. 
It's not a crucial change, maybe if Sky have free time, and that doesn't bother him, then go for it. 
I'd prefer to rework some skills, like remove recoil dmg from full house, make gun booster a decent buff for lions (+45% AC), increase the AoE range of some skills like Wind Blade, Inferno Blade, and some others. 

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19 minutes ago, Dazzle said:

I don't use any buffs when i'm playing, i can survive and OHKO monsters without it, is just a waste of time to cast buffs. 
Higher duration is not necessary for boss hunting, you kill it in 1- 60 sec depending on your class, so you don't need to recast buffs.
I don't understand why some players (even high level players with hax gears) activate all buffs in places that they don't need it.

It may help in Harkon Protector. 
It may help low level players. 
However, i agree with Sky, i don't think that will improve anything. 
It's not a crucial change, maybe if Sky have free time, and that doesn't bother him, then go for it. 
I'd prefer to rework some skills, like remove recoil dmg from full house, make gun booster a decent buff for lions (+45% AC), increase the AoE range of some skills like Wind Blade, Inferno Blade, and some others. 

I agree with the idea to rework other skills. Sadly I can't give much feedback since I'm not that familiar with skills outside the Magic Tree but I'm plenty sure that there are skills that need some serious reworking to make them worthwhile and not dead weight.

For example, Bottle of Mana. A 1390MP increase is nothing to sneeze at but on higher levels you can pretty much get the same MP from gear or compounding. If it was however reworked so that the increment was % rather than a flat increase then it would make it usable again. I know people might say that using a potion is enough or that you don't need that much MP but the idea is to give usefulness to something that even veterans would overlook.

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Its not a totally bad idea. Just make sure that its not TOO long, that would make it too easy. :kidding:

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Hey all! 

I like the idea of increasing buff durations, but 30 minutes is way too long. :sweat:

Maybe we could increase most necessary buffs like "Mist of Mana" to at least 5 minutes. (If possible)

Thanks to you GMs and Mods for taking in our considerations~ :heart:

Edited by Catty
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Sense buffs such as Gun Booster, Lucky Seven, and Sixth Sense have tiny, 2 minute duration at master level, making it feel like you're constantly buffing up when you have three or four buffs to maintain. An increase to a 5 minute or even 10+ minute duration would be great!

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I think buffs being min 5 min duration would be a nice change but also maybe increase the mp cost to balance it? Idk that just a thought

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I too believe that SOME buffs durations are annoying, like MANA REFLECTOR. It lasts few seconds, at least it feels like when killing a boss (it supposed to be hard i guess, but i don't enjoy casting every few seconds). 

Maybe at least double the duration time can already solve it.

Hey, double or nothing! :)

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I don't mind the increase of duration for those buff that will increase AP/MA/LK/AC/DA and etc. AKA Pumping Heart, Lucky Seven, Mist of Mana and etc.

But buff's like magic reflector, shield of heaven, Light Shield, Blessings, Sumo Suit and etc doesn't need those kind of duration. Think about it, the only way magic can win from charm is to immobilize them/Hinder them, and wait for their magic reflector to be gone(Especially for Dark Lords, Fear skill would be useless if the MR duration will be like 5mins+ :annoyed:) (Except for OP Mages like SM were they can just Arrow Rush those Charm who is using MR :smork:). Same goes with shield of heaven. I know that I'm thinking of PVP not the PVE, but I'm a pvp type of a player so I can't help but to think about the advantage and disadvantage of that kind of improvement for pvp :cool:

Edited by xJewelx
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7 hours ago, xJewelx said:

I don't mind the increase of duration for those buff that will increase AP/MA/LK/AC/DA and etc. AKA Pumping Heart, Lucky Seven, Mist of Mana and etc.

But buff's like magic reflector, shield of heaven, Light Shield, Blessings, Sumo Suit and etc doesn't need those kind of duration. Think about it, the only way magic can win from charm is to immobilize them/Hinder them, and wait for their magic reflector to be gone(Especially for Dark Lords, Fear skill would be useless if the MR duration will be like 5mins+ :annoyed:) (Except for OP Mages like SM were they can just Arrow Rush those Charm who is using MR :smork:). Same goes with shield of heaven. I know that I'm thinking of PVP not the PVE, but I'm a pvp type of a player so I can't help but to think about the advantage and disadvantage of that kind of improvement for pvp :cool:

If you're worried about PvP, maybe we can have the skills duration change based on the area you're in, PvP or not. Kinda like what other MMOs do when they split the skills up so they're not OP in either PvP or PvE. Maybe for example...

//set SoH default

duration "Shield of Heaven" = 300

//check if area is a pvp area or not, checks every time you enter a new area

function for when user enters new area

{

//if area is pvp, use a new duration

if area = pvp

{set duration "Shield of Heaven" = 66; break;}

//if its not a pvp area, reset duration to the default

else

{duration "Shield of Heaven" = 300; break;}

}

Something like that :sweat: A little rusty with my coding and psuedocode here. I dont really know how the coding works in this game so I'm not sure how difficult it would be. I personally would love longer durations, but I'm biased towards PvE :)

Edited by Alioran
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8 hours ago, xJewelx said:

I don't mind the increase of duration for those buff that will increase AP/MA/LK/AC/DA and etc. AKA Pumping Heart, Lucky Seven, Mist of Mana and etc.

But buff's like magic reflector, shield of heaven, Light Shield, Blessings, Sumo Suit and etc doesn't need those kind of duration. Think about it, the only way magic can win from charm is to immobilize them/Hinder them, and wait for their magic reflector to be gone(Especially for Dark Lords, Fear skill would be useless if the MR duration will be like 5mins+ :annoyed:) (Except for OP Mages like SM were they can just Arrow Rush those Charm who is using MR :smork:). Same goes with shield of heaven. I know that I'm thinking of PVP not the PVE, but I'm a pvp type of a player so I can't help but to think about the advantage and disadvantage of that kind of improvement for pvp :cool:

You have a point, but magics aren't supposed to beat charms anyway — it's the games' design.  As for SoH, it has always been OP.  Easily recast.

Edited by Serushi

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Please make buffs longer. For my lion I have 5 buffs I need to actively keep up and the shortest duration is 108 secs (which is very short). It takes me about 10 secs (yes I did time it) to cast all my buffs and since it takes so long to do this I need to run away from mobs and find a safe area to do this.

All in all, buffs are a pain in the butt and improving the duration would be sooo nice for me. Also don't make the MP cost go up too much, if at all, because my lion has a crappy Max MP and casting all my buffs together already take most of my MP bar.

Out of all the options listed above I think making buffs around 5 - 10 mins would be most reasonable.

Edited by UberPrinny

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Buffs longer would be good. Not sure about other classes buff duration but "Blood Testament" for Dark Lord costs 1000MP at Mastery and is only 54seconds.  Contrast that to Mist of Mana which is 380MP at a 3min duration, which requires less upkeep time and mana. If Blood Testament was about as long as Mist of Mana, i'd be happy enough with that honestly.

 

 

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